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At one point in history, working for the airlines was a glamorous profession. Beautiful, young and sophisticated flight attendants served passengers who were flying in high style, and for many it was even a big social event. A level of class and service was expected, and airlines delivered. Now, it has become one of the most thankless, mind numbing jobs on the planet. I know because I used to work for United Airlines before I became a lawyer. Dealing with annoyed, angry, drunk and frustrated passengers on a consistent basis is mentally draining and requires the highest level of patience, which I sometimes lack in my older years.

El Al, the national carrier of Israel, is legendary for its top notch security. However, security screening has absolutely no impact on abhorrent human behavior, which becomes more difficult to control at 35,000 feet above the sky. Last week, chaos ensued on an El Al flight from New York to Tel Aviv, when a group of ultra-Orthodox Jews boarded the flight to celebrate Rosh Hashanah in the Holy Land. Hundreds of the men demanded that other passengers switch seats, claiming they can't sit next to women on the long flight due to religious beliefs. Some of the men even offered to pay female passengers to move seats, but most refused. In some cases, because they didn't want to sit apart from their spouse, in others simply to make a statement that they didn't condone the extreme behavior of the men. Once the flight took off, most of the ultra-Orthodox men remained in the aisles, refusing to take their seat next to a woman. One fellow passenger called the flight an "11 hour nightmare!" Flight attendants couldn't serve drinks, meals, etc. because the aisles were blocked by the ultra-Orthodox Jews. Here's a photo from Twitter:

aisles

Now there are numerous petitions and complaints filed against El Al, with many claiming the airline promotes gender discrimination. In one article, a frequent flier of El Al claims this wasn't an isolated incident. She states that similar problems have occurred on past flights, with an increase in disturbances over the past few years. An American woman even sued El Al, claiming a flight attendant moved her to the back of the plane to accommodate one of the ultra-Orthodox passengers.

Of course, I respect and support all humans' rights to practice their religion. However, religious beliefs should never interfere with the civil rights of others. In any modern culture, freedom of flight and movement is a basic human right. So, El Al is in a difficult situation given its core client demographic.

What do you think? How would you react if you were on this flight? What should El Al do? Further information about this flight can be read on the following news sites: DailyMail UK, Washington Post, The Guardian, Jewish News, Haaretz and many other publications.

Related Post

Battle With Orthodox Jew

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Date: 2014-10-01 04:53 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pro100-petrov.livejournal.com
I would tell that guys to shut up.

Date: 2014-10-01 04:54 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
They would not listen! And then what? I don't know the reasoning for this extreme behavior. I don't think it has any basis in the Torah.

Date: 2014-10-01 05:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] siberian-cat.livejournal.com
And then the captain should return the plane back to NY, as they do when people start arguing -- not even fighting -- over reclining seats. And people in the isles refusing to take their seats is a safety impediment.

Date: 2014-10-01 05:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yarowind.livejournal.com
>>Some of the men even offered to pay female passengers to move seats,

was offered a little, I guess:)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pin-gwin.livejournal.com
The crew should return plane to NY, unload these ..... and bring them to the court. I surprised they did not do it.
Edited Date: 2014-10-01 05:02 pm (UTC)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:02 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pro100-petrov.livejournal.com
Nevertheless, if I were that women, I ll do something like this:

Off couse, it is not polite to talk this way, but...

To my mind, this problem could be puzzled by aviacompany before the flight. So, this situation is a big mistake of El-Al.
Edited Date: 2014-10-01 05:02 pm (UTC)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:03 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] girlspell.livejournal.com

I've flown El Al. But it was years ago when I was 16. I remember some Hasidim on the plane, but I don't remember them getting special treatment. By the way, there is a difference between being Orthodox and Hasidim. Hasidim are eastern European Jews entrenched in the the 18th century. Their clothing and mannerism are very similar to the extreme protestantism of the Amish. Also from Germany. Must be the water in Germany, LOL! It's more of a cult following. They are followers of a particular rabbi. I'm Orthodox too, but I'm western European and totally different in culture.

By the way, when I flew there (at 16) they still had tough security. I remember being targeted. I was singled out from the usual group of people trying get on the plane. I later found out the lone, single young women got extra security examination because sometimes a "boyfriend" will hand over a suitcase with a bomb on it to the lone girlfriend. As in the Pan Am Lockerbie bombing. Talk about being profiled!

Date: 2014-10-01 05:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] semicvetic.livejournal.com
they should learn something from arabs how to deal with stubborn women: they just dont allow women to travel without a superviser (husband or father)! and arabs are pretty successful in this: there are few arab countries where women could say or do smth against the will of men))))
Edited Date: 2014-10-01 05:07 pm (UTC)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:07 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
Apparently, the captain demanded that they sit down during take off and they complied. The flight was completely packed, as many were traveling to Israel to celebrate the New Year. However, once in the air, they got out of the seats and stood for 11 hours straight! Extreme dedication to religion. Such insanity I will never understand.

Date: 2014-10-01 05:08 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
I don't know what she' saying, but she looks scary! :)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:10 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
Honestly, I don't think I would have moved for even a large sum of money. My pride is worth more than that. But I can't say for sure. If they had waved $1,000 in my face perhaps I would have done it. :)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:11 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
I tried to think what would happen on a U.S. airline. The plane would have definitely been returned. We return flights over everything - minor disturbances and unruly passengers included! I would consider these men to fall into both of those categories. I doubt I would be able to control my temper if I was on the flight, and one of them spoke to me in a condescending manner.

Date: 2014-10-01 05:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
I also got pulled to the side by Israeli security in Tel Aviv. I'm not sure why, I think my Belarusian visa caused suspicion. They did not understand where the visa was from and asked me a lot of questions about it. Then, they moved me to a separate room and every single item was taken out of my carry on and checked bags, a magic wand was waved over all the items, and then I was asked all kinds of questions about past travel. Btw, how can you tell the difference between a Hasidic and Orthodox Jew? Do they wear different hats or clothes?

Date: 2014-10-01 05:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
Stubborn? Sitting in an assigned airline seat is stubborn? I don't think so. :)) Btw, isn't it a boring existence to have a woman do everything you ask or demand? Where's the challenge, stimulation or intrigue in that?
Edited Date: 2014-10-01 05:25 pm (UTC)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:18 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pin-gwin.livejournal.com
Also there is a good cooling place to unload these guys along the rout - Greenland. A week of public works there will improve their attitude

Date: 2014-10-01 05:21 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
A good idea! Btw, I really want to visit Greenland. Perhaps I could be their female supervisor, to add extra sting to their punishment. :))

Date: 2014-10-01 05:30 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] spawn999.livejournal.com
а че пост на буржуйском?

Date: 2014-10-01 05:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sasha-ek.livejournal.com
well, sounds like they need an ultra-ortodox airline.

Date: 2014-10-01 05:39 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] girlspell.livejournal.com
Hasidim wear the same long coat and hat that was the fashion during during the late 1700's in the area of Russia/Polish border. They are followers of a particular Rabbi. I mean, all a Jewish man (or woman) that are Orthodox wear clothing to be modest. Longer skirts, elbow length sleeves (or longer). Men must cover their heads all the time. Inside or outside of prayer. They might thing of God when they are not praying.That's why the Pope wears a Yamaka. Married women too. Single women can go around outside without any covering. Same thing with Islamic men and women. The exception, Islamic unmarried women still have to have a head covering. Again the reason is be be modest, plus a head covering shows your respect for God. Hair is sexual. It has always been that way. Monotheistic God is asexual. It has no place in worship, only in marriage. Even though Marriage is secular in Judaism and Islam. Only in Christianity, is marriage a sacrament.

Date: 2014-10-01 05:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
In America, we once had a "Hooters Airline," for men who wanted to stare at big tits and be served by scantily clad women on flights (see pic below). So, sure, why not have an ultra-Orthodox airline if this sect is so opposed to being in the company of females? Sounds like a good idea to me.

 photo hooters_zpsbbddbbc1.jpg

Date: 2014-10-01 05:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
Interesting, thanks. I asked because there were some men in Jerusalem wearing huge, furry hats (not the traditional black ones), and I thought they must belong to a particular branch of Judaism. I don't know how they wear such garments in the blazing desert sun and heat!

Date: 2014-10-01 05:46 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] girlspell.livejournal.com
If you were traveling alone (and female) they will pull you over. It send out a red flag. I think it's a little more then just a Belarusian visa. That's the way it is.

Date: 2014-10-01 05:49 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] peacetraveler22.livejournal.com
I have many Jewish friends in America, but none of them are Orthodox. So, it was really eye opening for me when I went to Jerusalem to see how things work in reality. I never knew that gender lines were so clearly drawn in Judaism. I've been to several synagogues in the States, and none separate the congregation on the basis of gender. Men and men are intermingled.
Edited Date: 2014-10-01 05:49 pm (UTC)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:53 pm (UTC)

Date: 2014-10-01 05:58 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fesma94.livejournal.com
I hate orthodoxes !!!!!!
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